Illinois vs. August Spies et al. trial transcript no. 1. Direct examination by Mr. Grinnell. Cross-examination by Captain Black. Testified on behalf of the Prosecution, People of the State of Illinois. Police Officer who heard Engel encourage people to buy guns and shoot policemen during a meeting at Timmerhoff's Place, February 1886. Also at the Haymarket meeting. Testified on various topics (page numbers provide a partial guide): plans for warfare against the police and/or capitalists (vol.J 86), call for workingmen to arm themselves (vol.J 86), medical care and wounds (vol.J 86), Engel, George (vol.J 85).
Testimony of Henry Weinecke (first appearance), 1886 July 22.
Volume J, 85-90, 6 p.
Weinecke, Henry.
Officer, Chicago Police Department; German immigrant.
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[Image, Volume J, Page 85]
Henry Wieneke,
a witness for the people, having been duly sworn was examined in chief by Mr. Grinnell, and testified as follows:
Q What is your name?
A Henry Wieneke.
Q You are a police officer?
A Yes sir.
Q Where is your station?
A West Chicago Avenue.
Q How long have you been policeman?
A Since the 20th of April.
Q Before that did you ever see any of the defendants?
A Yes sir.
Q Which one?
A On the other end, the last one.
Q Engel?
A Yes sir.
Q Where?
A 703 Milwaukee avenue.
Q Did you ever hear him make a speech?
A Yes sir.
Q What Hall or what place?
A Timmerhoff's Place, 703 Milwaukee avenue.
Q What did he say?
Objected to. Objection overruled; exception by defendants.
Q When was that?
A Sometime in February.
Q This last February?
A Yes sir, 1886.
Q Was it a meeting in a hall? Were there other people
there?
Objected to. Objection overruled, exception by defendants.
A Yes sir, it was in a hall.
Q Where were you when you heard him?
A I was standing in the door; the door that goes into the hall.
Q From what?
A From the saloon.
Q Well now, what did you hear him say?
A I heard him say, talking about buying revolvers for the police.
Q Well?
A He said he advised everbody--every man wants to join them to save up three or four dollars to buy a revolver to shoot every policemen down.
Q Did he say anything else--did he say anything about laboring man?
A Well, he says he want every working man who he could get to join them, and then advised everybody you know, you save up three or four dollars to buy a revolver that was good enough for shooting policeman down, he said.
Q You were at the Haymarket?
A Yes sir.
Q Got hit in the head. What company were you in?
A The first company---Lt. Steele's.
Q You were hit with a bullet, were you.
A Yes sir.
Mr. SALOMON--We move to exclude this testimony as irrelevant.
Motion overruled; exception by the defendants.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY
Mr. Black:
Q Was it before or after you joined the police that you heard Engel talk?
A That was before.
Mr. GRINNELL--Capt. Black, I will ask one other question.
Q What was the speech that you heard by Engel delivered in? English or in German?
A In German.
Q You understand German?
A Yes sir.
Q You are German?
A I am German.
Mr. BLACK--How much of an audience did Engel have there that night--how many people?
A I don't know. I wasn't in the hall. I stood in the door and listened to it.
Q Well, you could see in the hall, couldn't you?
A It was all crowded; every chair was set.
Q Every chair was full?
A It was not in the night. It was in the afternoon.
Q A public meeting, was it?
A Yes, I guess so.
Q Sunday or week-day?
A Sunday afternoon.
Q Anybody could go in there that wanted to?
A Yes sir.
Q And his advise was to every workingman to save three or four dollars and buy up revolvers?
A Yes sir.
Q And shoot the police?
A Yes sir.
Q Did he make any suggestion that police were to be shot if they interfered with the working men?
A He says
everybody comes to interfere--not interfere with them; every body they come across, he says.
Q Oh, every one that comes across?
A Yes sir.
Q Wanted to kill everybody whether they wanted to interfere or not?
A Yes sir.
Q Then you rushed off and joined the police force?
A The police was the first ones they wanted to.
Q You immediately after that joined the police force?
A I was not in the hall--I cannot tell you.
Q I ask you if soon after that you did not join the police force?
A I had calculations to join it.
Q You went right off--you were not deterred by that occurence were you?
Mr. GRINNELL--His bandage on his hand will show that he was not deterred.
Mr. SALOMON--That remark is not proper.
THE COURT--The word deterred is not one that is used by the witness.
Mr. BLACK--Q--You went on and joined the police, did you?
A Yes the 20th of April.
Q There wasn't anything said at all by Engel about the police interfering with working people?
A No sir, not what I heard, of it.
Q Not a word. Well, about how much of the speech did you hear?
A He said that and I went off.
Q You were there about how long at that door?
A Maybe about ten minutes.
Q About ten minutes, and it took Engel about ten minutes to say that, did it?
A No, there was another man had a speech there before, that I did not know.
Q How long did you hear Engel talk?
A I don't know how long he talked after I went away. I told you I went away just as soon as that.
Q How long had he been talking when you went away?
A I don't know.
Q Well, I thought you said somebody else was speaking part of the time.
A Before him, before him.
Q Were you there when he commenced to talk?
A That other fellow?
Q No sir. When Engel commenced to talk.
A Yes sir.
Q You were there when he commenced?
A Yes sir.
Q Now, how long did he talk while you staid there?
A Well, I was standing there about ten minutes, I told you and I went off. I don't know how long he talked after.
Q What I want to get at is how much of the ten minutes while you staid there was Engel talking and how much of the time was the other man talking?
A I don't know how long the other man was talking. I got there when he stopped, and he commenced.
Q You have told us all that you remember that Engel
said there at that time, have you?
A Not all; only this.
Q What else did he say that you remember?
A He did not say any more what I know of.
Q Then you have told us all that he said that you now remember.
A Yes sir. I wasn't there any longer. I cannot tell you any more.